DBS, BoG Clash: Not As Strong?

Herms explains the clash as the following:

So the pay-off to all that "Beerus can destroy the universe" hype. By "generation point" he presumably means the point from which the destructive power is being generated from...in other words, from where Beerus and Goku are fighting. While we don't get any more exposition on the subject besides what's above, the idea seems to be that since the destructive power increases the further away it gets from Goku and Beerus' battle, that's why people on Earth just get knocked over by these shockwaves, while further out into space the waves destroy entire planets.

(From Kazenshuu)

Doesn't that mean Goku's and Beerus clash force at the origin/their real power isn't actually not even planet level?

Beerus is universal. SSJ God Goku contributed half the energy to destroy the universe and Beerus was holding back massively so he should scale higher than the combined feat of ssj god goku and his suppressed power that matched that goku.

The shockwaves were felt from supreme Kai planet which is multiple galaxies away from earth.

An explosion would’ve happened if they had clashed that would destroy the whole universe 7.

@michaelmayhem97: Supreme Kai world is still above west, east, north, and south galaxy.

I don’t know why you posted like 4 posts.

I don’t scale movies and canon the same.

No one is is universal until dbs vs movies there are calcs of universal already. I think gogeta being born creating a big bang explosion was always kind of bs. An explosion didn’t create a big bang as pikkon and janemba were still there standing not effected by gogeta birth. I think it’s just the light of the fusion shined bright as a big bang. But that’s just my own personal opinion it doesn’t take away that those statements still exist and fusion reborn gogeta is still universal due to it.

Lol what's next. Piccolo busting the moon isn't moon level 🙃

@edgelord91: There’s actually a method to downplay it although very silly but I’m a dbz fan so I’ll never expose it or agree with it because of the gag nature. And because we flat out see the moon being destroyed twice and statements that back it up there’s no viable argument that isn’t from a gag. Or Kakarot game illusion lies.

Planet level punches creating universal shockwaves.

Make it make sense.

Potentially Beerus is universal, he and Champa both almost destroyed their own representative Macrocosms over a short timeframe. Consistency or Retcons are more an issue of the bad writting i am afraid, especially in the later DBS manga where Moro was confirmed to be impressive for being galaxy level.

I see you posting this often, care to elaborate so that people don´t flag you for trolling? Like i watch the anime and read the manga and there was never such a statement, so i guess it has to be in the databook which is the only valid evidence left from the media to support is canoncity, so you might send a scan to back up your claim.

If this isn´t the case (Other posting imply it is from some screen writer), then please refrain from using headcanon. We are a battleboard which heavy relies on the burden of proof, not based on invalid twitter/x claims which aren´t part of the official media. IIrc other screenwriter back in the day says Goku becomes only universal when he will be a GoD one day, remember?

Feel free to prove your takes, otherwise this can be ignored.

Nobody in db besides zeno is actually capable of one shotting a universe

Yeah, it's almost like the exact same thing is stated in the official translation for the anime, yet people always ignore it for some reason

Toriyama himself according to Koyama has never agreed with his view. Are you seriously claiming Koyama>WoG?
He even says it is his own opinion, so ignore everything he brought up related to twitter. By that alone i can ignore everything Twitter related as it is non canon, and against Toriyama´s idea. Shame on you that you literally piss on his grave with your takes. How disrespectful.

I don´t know why are you also posting content from a Tabletop RPG Toriyama has no say in it, it isn´t even canon to OG DB. The databook statements you brought up here for higher dimension only is vague and works in every fiction differently. Again show me where is an infinite dimensions or infinite size statement without any official contradictions. i will be waiting

@michaelmayhem97: Definitely only universal

There are no multi universes in one universe dbs having their own numbered universe is proof of that. The north galaxy, south, east, west, are large portions of the universe.

He just debunked your nonsense, no death of the author given. Toriyama is the only author who have the rights to expand the cosmology. Try again, by providing evidence, instead of making up headcanon. I posted more evidence in the other threads regarding his statements and it has clearly not to do with harassing him. His statements are valid the same was as they you bring them up, so yeah i debunked it with your own evidence

So let me get this straight. You take Koyama statements for valid, but not his takes which contradict the said statements. Rather you take some fan interpretations about how and why Koyama answered that way as more valid?

@michaelmayhem97 said:

@thedukeofwei: harassed.

And where did he said, he just made some statements because of he was harassed? Because that is still the evidence you need, but then again even if: He said, ask Toriyama for Cosmology, so...

He was harassed by me? I don´t even have a twitter account lmao

Also i have better things to do, why should i annoy him? The fans annoyed him already with the infinite dimensional questions, or Garlic Jr. questions, etc. where he clearly feeled uncomfortable with. His statements are up today not valid for a dabte, and they will not be in future. Before that is accepted, VSB will rather accept outerversal Goku and even they don´t buy into Koyama statements, despite they obviously wank DB.

Doesn´t mean i have to downplay Beerus in the actual topic here by assuming he isn´t universal. He just isn´t multiversal or infinity, or whatsoever you argue.

Now excuse me, i have a bit better stuff to do. If you find meanwhile any significant evidence to convince me otherwise feel free to tag me. If not, then leave it. Debating about twitter statements independent of official media should be never part of a debate here anyway. Its good when you feel better because someone gives you hope, but the reality always looks different and we go by that always by the burden of proof. Official media/Canon of course. Although i really would like to use Tappei his statements for Reinhard from Re Zero, it would be fun, but nah it isn´t right.

Also you should do something about your screenshot format and rather use the scans directly, then some shots from a YouTube video, because that alone disqualified a debater here.

How many times do we really have to see same debnked stuff? Shockwaves were at their weakest in Old Kai world that was furtherest away, they were only weaker around earth due to Goku trying to save it and they were not even only universal feat two had in BoG, several universal feats in BoG were unrelated to shockwaves at all( like beam clash, orb etc).

@aaronyogurt said:

Yeah, it's almost like the exact same thing is stated in the official translation for the anime, yet people always ignore it for some reason

It's almost like there's context for that in form of Goku trying to nullify the destruction of the shockwaves by perfecting angles of his fists, but of course that's always ignored in those troll threads for some reason...

@gaoron said:

@aaronyogurt said:

Yeah, it's almost like the exact same thing is stated in the official translation for the anime, yet people always ignore it for some reason

It's almost like there's context for that in form of Goku trying to nullify the destruction of the shockwaves by perfecting angles of his fists, but of course that's always ignored in those troll threads for some reason...

it’s physically impossible for Goku to nullify earths solar systems but not outside it at the same time lol as if he could do that the waves wouldn’t of been capable of spreading in the first place as they would lose their point of origin meaning no starting point for them to spread from

Goku didn’t succeed until the 3rd clash meaning the first few waves have no excuses what your saying is head canon

You guys cannot be serious right now right …. ?

Old Kai says the shockwaves were a show, Inapplicable / Irrelevant To the Power in destroying the Universe. Despite Kibito Kai saying They’re channeling way more divine energy then before. Ap≠Dc is confirmed guys which is called Ki Control.

Shockwaves Doesn’t matter. thread should be locked

@darkphantom9895 said:

@gaoron said:

@aaronyogurt said:

Yeah, it's almost like the exact same thing is stated in the official translation for the anime, yet people always ignore it for some reason

It's almost like there's context for that in form of Goku trying to nullify the destruction of the shockwaves by perfecting angles of his fists, but of course that's always ignored in those troll threads for some reason...

it’s physically impossible for Goku to nullify earths solar systems but not outside it at the same time lol as if he could do that the waves wouldn’t of been capable of spreading in the first place as they would lose their point of origin meaning no starting point for them to spread from

Goku didn’t succeed until the 3rd clash meaning the first few waves have no excuses what your saying is head canon

Goku succeeded the 3rd time hence there was no further shockwaves, first 2 tries Goku tried but didn't quite found the perfect angle hence shockwaves were weakened but still carried universal busting cababilities.

Later on in the fight we have confirmation Goku and Beerus still carry universal potency in their punches only now the destruction is completely absent because Goku learned how to fight without endangering the universe.

@darkphantom9895 said:

@gaoron said:

@aaronyogurt said:

Yeah, it's almost like the exact same thing is stated in the official translation for the anime, yet people always ignore it for some reason

It's almost like there's context for that in form of Goku trying to nullify the destruction of the shockwaves by perfecting angles of his fists, but of course that's always ignored in those troll threads for some reason...

it’s physically impossible for Goku to nullify earths solar systems but not outside it at the same time lol as if he could do that the waves wouldn’t of been capable of spreading in the first place as they would lose their point of origin meaning no starting point for them to spread from

Goku didn’t succeed until the 3rd clash meaning the first few waves have no excuses what your saying is head canon

It’s also physically impossible to move past the speed of light lol Stop being so technical on the physics, this is Fiction after all. Goku said He was trying to perfect His already Known technique on the first (second lol) attempt.

(And Yes this trick is already Been known before-hand by Goku during his fight with Beerus, since the days of DBZ)

This indicates The Entire Shockwaves of the 2 attempts were nulled it’s just that the origin point was at the strongest in being nulled at

@bright_diamond:

Stop being so technical on the physics, this is Fiction after all. Goku said He was trying to perfect His already Known technique on the first attempt.

bro actually said stop being technical and ignore everything to wank Goku as much as possible

I know Goku was trying to perfect it but he did not succeed until the 3rd meaning there’s no excuse for the waves what your trying to claim is simply not possible Goku cannot nullify earth’s solar system but not outside of it at the same time if Goku nullifies earth’s solar system solar system then the waves can’t get stronger as they would lose their point of orgin and meaning they would lose their supply of energy meaning the waves just wouldn’t exist at all or or would dissipate and get weaker not stronger there’s no in universe excuse for you just accept it

(And Yes this trick is already Been known before-hand by Goku during his fight with Beerus, since the days of DBZ)

name when this was ever stated to be used since DBZ if Goku was a master at this the waves never would’ve existed in the first place

This indicates The Entire Shockwaves of the 2 attempts were nulled it’s just that the origin point was at the strongest in being nulled at

What does that even mean if the point of origin was nulled then the waves would get weaker but that’s not what happened

that’s it I’m going to do like the db alt troll above and summon WoG let’s ask DBS screen writer

Dang not even a screen writer agrees