MutantHeroic Presents: DC Superhero Logic - Story of Superman (ft. The Presence)

Introduction

Superhero Logic (a term I coined) is the metaphysical plot armor central to the DC universe's metaphysics that DC superheroes possess, allowing them to counter multiversal threats and cosmic entities in every Crisis event such as Anti-Monitor, Mandrakk, Perpetua, and Darkseid, preventing them from fully conquering or destroying the DC multiverse. This fundamental force in the DC universe ensures that all causality, time, and existence revolve around the story of Superman and other DC superheroes, guaranteeing that they will always be able to push back against the Gods of DC who threaten to plunge the universe into darkness despite the fact that they are massively weaker.

The truth is that Superhero Logic is a creation of The Presence (who is Omnipotent in both DC and Vertigo) that he uses to manipulate the entire DC Universe into revolving around the stories of DC Superheroes from Superman to Batman and etc., ensuring they always get the right powerups at the right time and place no matter how improbable that is, to eventually beat back the Antagonist DC Gods (Anti-Monitor, Mandrakk, Perpetua, and Darkseid) attempting to either destroy or conquer the entire DC universe. Superhero Logic also ensures that DC Superheroes in the case of defeat, will eventually persevere no matter what to recover or resurrect, which has also occurred many times across all Crisis events.

Most readers of DC Comics already recognize that Superhero Logic is not merely "PIS" but is already an actual metaphysical in-universe feature of the DC Universe that can't be denied, but I thought about making a thread that would collect all scans that would go about proving that Superhero Logic exists anyway since some people for some reason continue to deny it's a thing despite it being central to the story and narrative.

But that's not all, I will also be proving that Superhero Logic was designed by the Presence as fundamental to his planet for his Creations, and that the Presence is the prime mover behind Superhero logic.

Brief History of Superhero Logic

Since at least Final Crisis (2008), DC writers began strongly implying and suggesting the existence of Superhero Logic as a power of DC Superheroes (primarily Superman), in the narrative of Final Crisis, we are introduced to the Nil Monitors, those avatars of the original Monitor from COIE, as cosmic entities with at least multi-solar system level power and time manipulation (to a degree), they had been hyping Superman's story and the power of Superheroes as the predestined centers and protectors of Creation meant to defeat all threats to existence, then we had Captain Atom treat Superman as the final hope to save the universe, as if his story is all that can empower the CAS robot.

Later in Doomsday Clock (2017-2019), we had Dr. Manhattan, the only DC character with a straight up infinite multiversal creation/destruction feat (which he did with his mind only no less), basically tell us that he had difficulty editing Superman's history because he was being protected by the will of the DC Metaverse, which had been secretly manipulating the narrative of DC history to make sure Superheroes stand strong resiliently against Gods and successfully defeat all attempts of domination of the Dark Gods such as Darkseid, Perpetua, etc.

Also in Doomsday Clock, we also had the Presence being implied to have enabled Superman to change the mind of Dr. Manhattan to shift his nihilistic world view to that of a Light hearted, Humanism world view, very similar to what Naruto did to Obito except there's infinite shenanigans involved and it was applied to an infinite multiversal god. It got so bad that, that Dr. Manhattan began praying to the Presence.

And in the latest instance, in DC All in Special (2024) we had Spectre basically telling us that the Presence had set Superman as the manifestation of all hope in the DC Omniverse, that everything revolves around his story one way or another, and that he is opposed by Darkseid who embodies darkness in the entire DC Omniverse, and how everything revolves around them.

Respect Thread Index

Section A. Dr. Manhattan says the entire DC Omniverse revolves around and influences the power of Superman and ensures he always survives Crisis Events, with the Presence being implied to be behind Superhero Logic (Doomsday Clock, New 52-Rebirth, 2017-2019)

To prove Superhero Logic is real in DC, I highlight the account from Doomsday Clock where Dr. Manhattan explains that the entire DC Cosmology basically revolves around Superman's story, and that no matter how many times Superman dies, Superman and friends will always be resurrected to beat back the Gods of DC, and that the DC Metaverse ensures that Superheroes will win against the Crisis Gods by endlessly resurrecting them no matter how many times they are defeated, until they eventually win.

The end of the comic book also strongly implies that the Presence guides Superhero Logic.

• A1. The DC Metaverse provided Superman the power to kill Dr. Manhattan as it was a threat to the Multiverse, Dr. Manhattan is someone who has both a blatant infinite multiversal creation feat and an infinite multiversal erasure feat in "Before Watchmen". This could explain why DC Gods have so many anti-feats to Midtier Superheroes as they receive subconscious powerups from the DC Metaverse to counter cosmic entities. The end of the comic strongly suggested the Presence is behind all these events.
• A2. Superman is the Center of the DC Metaverse, which is the narrative center and origin of all Multiverses in the Omniverse. This means Superman has some Omniversal properties.
• A3. The DC Metaverse preserves every version of Superman at every age, and will eventually unite them all.
• A4. The Multiverse uses reality warping to ensure that Superman and Superheroes as a whole survives every Crisis Event, no matter how many times they are attacked, ensuring their eventual victory.
• A5. The Superhero Plot Armor of Superman literally causes Dr. Manhattan to abandon his dark, nihilistic and detatched ways, and made him a Humanist, who acknowledges the Presence's hand in destiny and having faith in his plan.

Section B. Spectre says Superman and Darkseid embody all the Hope and Darkness in the entire DC Omniverse as part of the Presence's Plan (DC All in Special, October 2 2024)

This section concerns scans from "DC All in Special" it's the most recent detailed account and explanation on how Superhero Logic works, coming from the mouth of Spectre himself.

• B1. The Spectre says Omniverse's Causality revolves around Light and Darkness, embodied by Superman and Darkseid who represent the Good and Darkness of the entire Omniverse, all as part of the Presence's Plan

Section C. The Monitor Race accounts that Superman is the basis of the entire DC Universe and all its Hope (Final Crisis, 2008)

This section accounts for how the DC Universe was made in the image of Superman, or at least treats Superman as its central principle, when the "Flaw" was drawn within the Overvoid, it manifested in the form of a giant metallic Superman that would later come to be known as the Thought Robot.

Further, the Monitor. and Captain Atom account that only Superman's energies can power the Thought Robot to defeat Mandrakk, and is the only being in existence at the time who could have saved everyone and everything from Mandrakk.

• C1. Zillo Valla, a Monitor with universe level time stopping powers, needs Superman's help to save existence from Mandrakk.
• C2. The Overvoid felt threatened by the narratives of Superhero stories, sealing the Multiverse caused it to bleed in the form of Thought Robot Superman, and the Overvoid observes that the Multiverse conceptually and metaphysically revolves entirely around Superhero stories.
• C3. Captain Atom claims that only Superman can save cosmic entities of the likes him and everyone else to save everyone from Mandrakk, and that only Superman and Ultraman's energies can power up the Thought Robot, no one else can.
• C4. Superhero Logic is based on beliefs and is a story meant to be indestructible and unstoppable, which counters the narrative energies that power Dark Gods like Mandrakk, who are also powered by beliefs
• C5. The Monitors and Mandrakk claimed that Superman can't take the Bleed Antidote to save his wife because no one other than Monitors can contain Bleed, however Superman is able to take it to Lois and save her from dying anyway, and the narrative says he defied it simply because he's Superman, strongly suggesting that Superman changed the rules about bleed with Superhero Plot Armor.
• C6. Nix Uotan says that Superheroes of the Multiverse is the Multiverse's natural defenses against Evil and Dark Gods.

Section D. DC Gods acknowledging the power of Superheroes

This section concerns statements and accounts from numerous DC Gods and some other statements, entailing the existence of the power of Superheroes by their stories or something along those lines.

• D1. Unkindness Raven and Trigon are impressed by the Teen Titan's ability to defeat the Gods of the DC Universe, and thus treat Superhero logic as a big deal.
• D2. Starman explains that Connective Energy is divided into 7 primordial aspects upon which are the principles of the DC Multiverse, each of them corresponding to a specific member of the Justice League, suggesting that Justice League members are the manifestation of the wills of the principles of Creation. Which is consistent with the DC Universe forming and revolving around Superman.

Conclusion Section

Conclusion section is at the bottom of this OP post.

See Also:

• Click here for why the Presence is Omnipotent in the Lucifer Vol I by M. Carey Sub-Canon

• Click here for why the Presence is superior to both Light/Source/Overvoid and the Great Darkness

• Click here for why Transfinite Cosmology Tiering is illogical and shouldn't be used for powerscaling at all, and why all infinities are the same size in a physical context

Section A. Doomsday Clock (2017-2019) New 52-Rebirth

Doomsday Clock is actually funniest part of this section, because it basically was the first time that the Presence was strongly suggested to be behind Superhero logic, given the end statement of the comic itself, and it's written by the former CEO of DC at the time.

A1. Dr. Manhattan said that Superman is the DC Multiverse's defense mechanism against cosmic entities like him, and that Superman had a chance of killing Dr. Manhattan. This could explain all DC God anti-feats to Superheroes.

Going by Dr. Manhattan, who by "Before Watchmen" had been retconned to having a feat of both creating and destroying an infinite multiverse with his mind and will, admitted that while he could destroy the DC Metaverse, the DC Metaverse (which is a living organism that governs the whole DC Omniverse) likewise could have killed Dr. Manhattan by empowering Superman to do so, to defend itself from cosmic threats like Dr. Manhattan.

I don't mean this to suggest that Superman is some multiverse killer, but in rare occasions, this suggests that the mind of the DC universe does and will back up Superman to multiversal levels when necessary.

This could explain why DC Gods have so many anti-feats to Midtier Superheroes as they receive subconscious powerups from the DC Metaverse to counter cosmic entities that threaten the DC Metaverse and the Omniverse as a whole, when it's necessary, as is the case of Superman.

A2. Superman is the Center of the Universe, which is the center of the Multiverse

Dr. Manhattan explains that Superman is the center of Earth 0 or Prime Earth, also known as the Metaverse, and that the Metaverse forms around Superman specifically, and forces such as the Anti-Monitor and Extant have directly targeted Superman's timeline many times, we are also told that the entire DC Multiverse sort of "revolves" around changes to Prime Earth, as if the Metaverse was the capital of the Multiverse.

To expand this, a more recent comic, Justice League Flashpoint Beyond (2022) tells us that the Metaverse, which is a sentient universe is the origin of all Multiverses in the Omniverse, so yes, Superman's history and story being protected from Gods like Dr. Manhattan by the Metaverse is a huge deal.

To prove my point? Here is a scan where, after Dr. Manhattan deletes the DC Metaverse, the DC Metaverse instantly regenerates itself back from non-existence, and is stated that it formed around Superman centrally "forms around the one and only son", proving that the DC Metaverse is in fact, responsible for Superhero resurrections and revolves its own causality around Superman and Superhero stories.

A3. The Multiverse's primary reason for splitting into new timelines is to preserve every age of Superman, creating new timelines for the previous generation, and a new superman for the new generation.

The Multiverse will one day reunite every version of Superman that had existed in all generations, by then, Humanity will have fully embraced Superman's Ways and lead to a new era of peace.

A4. The Multiverse uses reality warping to ensure that Superman and Superheroes as a whole survives every Crisis Event, no matter how many times they are attacked, they are always resurrected by the Metaverse, ultimately ensuring their eventual victory.

A5. Dr. Manhattan, a being who created and destroyed an Infinite Multiverse, is so inspired by Superman that he abandons his Nihilistic ways and begins making wishes to the Presence, suggesting that his destiny is guided by a higher being.

To prove my point that the Presence was the guiding hand in the narrative, the end of the comic basically had this to say at the end.

Section B. DC All In Special (October 2, 2024) Rebirth

So in DC All in Special, Darkseid basically goes on a rampage throughout Creation, defeating both Heaven and Hell in search for the Spectre, Darkseid uses the Miracle Machine to forcibly bond himself to the Spectre to explain to him why Darkseid is suffering an unnerving explosive surge in energy that makes him unease, which of course, what caused him to rampage all over Creation to find the Spectre.

B1. The Omniverse's Causality revolves around Light and Darkness, embodied by Superman and Darkseid who represent the Good and Darkness of the entire Omniverse

Spectre tells a desperate Darkseid that he is a key player in Creation.

Darkseid always knew this, and demands that there must be more, to which Spectre responds that Life expands and multiplies against all odds and that Life is Hope, and that if anyone embodies that Hope in the entire Omniverse, it is Superman.

3. To prove my point that Darkseid and Superman embody Dark and Hope respectively at an "Omniversal" level in DC's context, Darkseid's energies expanded the moment the Multiverse expanded into an Omniverse, this means the Hope that Superman embodies expands to the Omniverse as well.

4. Darkseid acknowledges that both he and Superman are basically pawns in the grand scheme of things to a higher will (obviously referring to the Presence's plan who created the Light and Darkness, keeping the two in balance). This would later bring him to form the Absolute Universe, in an attempt to escape the plan that the Presence had laid out for him.

So what concludes this section? The Presence created both Light (Superman) and Darkness (Darkseid) as the respective avatars of the hope for life, and the struggles of darkness that life goes through at each stage of evolution and expansion into existence.

The Presence basically chose the two of them to embody these two principles which steers the narrative of Creation forward.

Section C. Final Crisis (2008) Superhero Logic becomes Canon for the first time

Final Crisis was the first time when DC decided to make Superhero plot-armor, an actual in-universe RNG power of Superhero characters within DC, the first implications began when Monitors, who are cosmic entities who at least had universe level time stopping powers, kept on hyping up how significant and profound the stories and deeds of Superheroes are to impacting the direction and story of the multiverse at large.

C1. Zillo Valla needs Superman's help to save existence from Mandrakk

Here, Zillo Valla, the fact she stops time at a universe level just so she can talk to Superman, and literally offers Superman a universal antidote that can save Lois Lane's cancer in exchange for his services of saving existence from Mandrakk, tells us as all that Monitors, as cosmic entities, were already long aware of the importance that Superman has to the universe.

Gallery

C2. The Overvoid felt threatened by the narratives of Superhero stories, sealing the Multiverse caused it to bleed in the form of Thought Robot Superman, and the Overvoid observes that the Multiverse conceptually and metaphysically revolves entirely around Superhero stories

Gallery

C3. Captain Atom claims that only Superman can save cosmic entities of the likes him and everyone else to save everyone from Mandrakk, and that only Superman and Ultraman's energies can power up the Thought Robot, no one else can.

C4. Superhero Logic is based on beliefs and is a story meant to be indestructible and unstoppable, which counters the narrative energies that power Dark Gods like Mandrakk, who are also powered by beliefs

C5. The Monitors and Mandrakk claimed that Superman can't take the Bleed Antidote to save his wife because no one other than Monitors can contain Bleed, however Superman is able to take it to Lois and save her from dying anyway, and the narrative says he defied it simply because he's Superman, strongly suggesting that Superman changed the rules about bleed with Superhero Plot Armor.

Gallery

C6. Nix Uotan says that Superheroes of the Multiverse is the Multiverse's natural defenses against Evil and Dark gods

So what concludes this section? Superhero Plot Armor being a canonical, in-universe "RNG" power of DC Superheroes has been a thing since at least Final Crisis (2008), we have the Monitors who have at least demonstrated universe level time stopping, and are Creation's overseers, treating Superheroes and Superhero stories as the conceptual center and purpose of the Multiverse, as well as the Multiverse's natural defenses against Dark Gods of Crisis events like Mandrakk and Darkseid.

Moreover, DC Gods during this time treat Superman as the only solution to powering the Thought Robot, which of course was the only means of dealing with Mandrakk.

Finally, we had Superman actually defy a rule about Bleed, which prior could only be contained by gods like Monitors? Superman defied it narratively by taking it with him to save Lois anyway, simply by being Superman.

Section D. DC Gods acknowledging the power of Superheroes

D1. Unkindness Raven tries to convince Trigon to recruit the Teen Titans due to their history of defeating Gods

Now before you argue that "Trigon didn't care about Superhero Logic, he was just acting to appease Raven" or "Raven didn't mean that, she was just trying to find an excuse to spare her former friends" understand that even if that was true? It doesn't matter because Unkindness Raven actually thinks that the Teen Titans and their Superhero logic of contributing to the demise of past threats to the DC Universe was something WORTH bragging to Trigon as a bargaining chip to spare them, and actually thought that they were powerful enough narratively that Trigon would be convinced of their power, even if it was a deception on Raven's part due to some part of her wanting to spare the lives of her former friends.

This means that Superhero Logic was THAT STRONG that both Raven and Trigon were both convinced of going along with how powerful Superhero logic to deceive the other.

D2. Starman explains that Connective Energy is divided into 7 primordial aspects upon which are the principles of the DC Multiverse, each of them corresponding to a specific member of the Justice League, suggesting that Justice League members are the manifestation of the wills of the principles of Creation. Which is consistent with the DC Universe forming and revolving around Superman.

Conclusion

So, I have posted numerous scans and stories stretching over at a range of 17 years of DC Comics history and in between, of the DC narrative blatantly telling you that DC Superhero canonical plot armor is a literal metaphysical feature of the DC universe's rules.

With that, I also proved that the Presence has a strong link to it, or at least, Superhero logic is pretty much a major principle of his grand design and plan over the cosmos.

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Call Outs

@pedrolopesmateus @gshshe @justmikexd @carnocookie

Fantastic post still didn't finish reading till now but it's great

Good post. But it seems to concern almost exclusively Superman? Street-levelers also have superhero logic, right?

@mutantheroic: also:

How can you stand reading so much mainstream DC comics? Lol.

I read the OG Swamp Thing run and his appearances in other superhero books before reading Moore's Saga of the Swamp Thing, and it SUCKED. Extremely hardcore. I hadn't read mainstream marvel and DC for years and forgot how terrible it was. If anyone was interested in ST I'd recommend to skip everything before Moore or at most read the 19 issues of Saga of Swamp Thing before Moore became the writer.

Superhero logic occurs within all DC Superheroes across all tiers to various degrees, and it occurs within Batman who is the only one whose Superhero logic is either comparable, equal to or even sometimes surpasses that of Superman.

We had two cosmic crisis events revolving around his evil selves, Dark Knights Metal and then Dark Knights Death Metal, and the Darkest Knight is blatantly more directly powerful than any version of Superman (including TR) since he scales to all past Crisis Energies, including Thought Robot Superman, COIE Anti-Monitor, and Darkseid.

As for street tiers in general, I posted in point "D1" we have Unkindness Raven and Trigon caught hyping how awesome the Teen Titans are for having beaten Gods, Monsters and even Trigon in the past and are worth sparing, and Teen Titans are either known for street tiers or being lead by one, that being Nightwing.

As a bonus? Here is Red Robin stabbing Trigon, in the back of his head.

And as for DC Superheroes in general? We have confirmation that the DC Multiverse has 7 fundamental energies, each one connected to a certain member of the Justice League.

The reason why this thread revolves around Superman generally is that my thread here was mainly focused on proving that Superhero is a thing, that is also connected to the Presence.

The most detailed narratives that most blatantly tell you Superhero logic is a thing and explains it in most detail ALSO tend to connect it strongly to the Presence, and these three kinds of Superhero logic explanation only occurs when DC Gods are hyping up how great Superman is, and this thread of course exists to prove Superhero logic is both a thing and connected to the Presence, so that's why this thread ended up revolving around Superman.

I can fill this thread with much more stuff on Superhero logic (there's much more), but I feel it may saturate the important connection that Superhero logic has to the Presence, hence, I sort of minimized it because links between the Presence and Superhero logic only occurs when DC explains how Superhero logic works in regards to Superman.

I plan to make future threads on Superhero logic across the board, including more feats, but this thread had to come first as it has the fundamentals on Superhero logic.

@mutantheroic: Thanks, bro.

Does superhero logic also exist in the Sandman/Vertigo universe?

Absolutely not. Superhero logic is never at any point in Vertigo a thing, nor even acknowledge, even Classic Swamp Thing kind of thinks little of Superheroes.

The Presence in Vertigo has a very different personality from the Presence in DC to the point they can't even be the same character, in Vertigo, the Presence wants to fill his curiosity of knowing and then not knowing, and revolves his Creation around Lucifer, and ultimately left Creation. In mainline DC, the Presence wants to solve human suffering using Superman and other DC Superheroes over a span of 1,000 years.

If anything, it's more appropriate to say that Vertigo has "Lucifer logic" since he tends to pull Sukuna style "Ah yes, my Anti-Technique, I haven't used that since the Heian era" asspulls whenever he's on the brink of defeat, you see this when Fenris and Noema Presto both spectacularly failed to see that Lucifer still had enough power to start his destructive power to kill Fenris in the final battle, or how of course, prior to Mike Carey, we had 0 idea that Lucifer was some powerful reality warping that could delete beings that could warp 1000 laws of the Presence's Creation, or negate the hax of Endless tier beings passively.

Even the Vertigo reboot does this, suddenly Lucifer is the being upon whom even TGD and the Source depends on for their existence, suddenly a weakened depowered Lucifer can casually toy in a 1v4 against 4 fundamental war gods who embody abstract rules of the Presence's Creation, etc.

The only time you have Vertigo "acknowledging" Superhero logic is when Dream of the Endless asked Superman and Batman for help to stop Barbatos and treated Barbatos as threat to everything he knows, however, this is concerning Mainline DC's incarnation of the Endless, which isn't canon nor applicable to the actual Vertigo canon because Dream never needs help for Dream Vortexes, he kills them on the spot, which is all that Barbatos really was in the end.

@mutantheroic: interesting, thanks.

Superman being the epitome of Superhero Logic must have been a cool thing to write about. He is my favorite superhero, so it is awesome to see that. I do think there are some other stories to mention (Where is Thy Sting and Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow) but they may or may not have been necessary to add. This thread perfectly summarizes Superhero Logic in DC through recent stories within the last decade and so. I assume you might choose Marvel next or does DC provide the better content that you might make more threads about Superhero Logic for other DC characters? Perhaps going over in a sequel to this thread that include notable moments in DC regarding an important villain Superman or any hero has fought like the Anti-Monitor, Parallax, and Dominus.

Off topic, but do you think you might make a thread on SCP eventually or will that go over on in an upcoming part regarding Tegmark's Type IV Multiverse? You did go over Destiny a bit in another thread in how terrible the author is at math, so that might be something.

Well yeah, Superhero Logic is abundant in DC, however this thread focused on Doomsday Clock and DC All in Special primarily because they are one of the few works that tell us that the Presence is directly involved with it. Therefore telling us the fundamental essence of Superhero Logic as a primary function of the Presence's Plan.

The focus of this thread is not just to prove that Superhero Logic is a thing, it's to prove that the Presence is empowering it himself which for my purpose was just as important.

I mentioned Final Crisis because it's arguably the earliest work that explicitly mentions Superhero logic as an actual force and to highlight how "old" the concept is in DC, however, I didn't want to go beyond that because it might derail from the crux of the issue about the Presence's connection to it, which upscales DC's Superhero logic to be absolutely more powerful than equivalents in other settings.

I would add other works to this thread but only if there are works I wasn't aware of that foretells the Presence's involvement with Superhero logic.

But just to note, Superhero logic isn't a thing in Vertigo. I am currently building a thread under construction using this fact to explain why DC and Vertigo aren't canon as the first most important point.

I assume you might choose Marvel next or does DC provide the better content that you might make more threads about Superhero Logic for other DC characters?

DC is absolutely far more explicit on Superhero Logic than Marvel is, most of what we got from Marvel was an explanation from Thor that it's meaningless to compare the feats and power scales of Superheroes since their power is relative to the need for it, and that Superheroes are the defenders of the Universe.

However, we don't even know where Superhero Logic fundamentally comes from in Marvel, it's explained that it has something to do with Superheroes having powerful narrative forces due to being the new believed in Gods supplanting the Gods of Old in terms of prominence, but who created the framework? It's not TOAA definitely.

Because of that, we don't even know how strong Superhero Logic would be in a crossover scenario, we know how powerful Superhero Logic would be in DC if it was applied in a crossover scenario since the Presence (who is Omnipotent in Mainline DC as well) is its basis.

I was planning to make a thread on Marvel's Superhero logic, but it's just not explicit enough for me to delve into it yet.

I would also argue that DC's Superhero Logic is structurally superior to Marvel. Superman and Batman are the cores of all of Superhero Logic, and the Superhero Logic of other Superheroes are derived from them via being inspired by the former 2, so it's easy to know who is the strongest and where it came from and how it mechanically works, it makes it more "organized" and easier to recognize.

Hell, even all the times that Raven beats Trigon, even though Superman doesn't do it himself, we know that Raven beats Trigon through the Hope received from Superman, so it all again, goes back to Superman.

I just don't agree with the notion that Batman's Superhero Logic derived from Superman, he seems to be equal and independent. That Milkman Superman storyline claimed that Batman's Superhero Logic derived from Superman but iirc that story was considered non-canon (which is also why it wasn't used here).

Meanwhile in Marvel, nobody seems to be the center of Superhero Logic, it's all disorganized and unpredictable because the various factions of the Marvel Fandom are hyper-competing on whose Superhero favorite is the best, from the Hulk faction vs Wanda faction vs Phoenix faction vs Thor faction vs Doom faction, etc.

This Civil War is happening even on Comicvine where Marvel Debaters are largely more focused (a lot of the times) on tearing each other apart than dealing with DC debaters. So the writers of Marvel CANNOT make Superhero Logic as neatly organized and centeralized as DC because they have to cater to the equally distributed hyper competition of the fandom.

Perhaps going over in a sequel to this thread that include notable moments in DC regarding an important villain Superman or any hero has fought like the Anti-Monitor, Parallax, and Dominus.

Yeah, I was planning a similar thread that approaches the opposite direction. Where I go over the details of how DC Gods lost to the Superheroes to Superhero logic, and it varies from luck or circumstances bending around them.

But we also have outright ridiculous moments similar to Dr. Manhattan being almost killed by Superman.

We had a team of Midtier Superheroes beat up COIE Anti-Monitor off-screen which suggests that Superhero Logic has become so powerful that Old Villains don't mean much to Superheroes anymore.

We also had the ridiculous moment in Dark Crisis where Nightwing somehow..... being conduit that resisted Infinite Multiversal power from consuming the DC Multiverse and being the conduit for recovering the Pre-COIE Multiverse, and he wasn't amped or anything.

Off topic, but do you think you might make a thread on SCP eventually or will that go over on in an upcoming part regarding Tegmark's Type IV Multiverse? You did go over Destiny a bit in another thread in how terrible the author is at math, so that might be something.

Well... the thing about SCP is that it's a dead verse already, nobody debates for it on Comicvine and when VSwiki banished that verse to the Shadow Realm, the hype just died.

All we have to say about SCP is that it's a subfictional/subreality level verse because of the R>F Layers, putting it on the likes of Matrix and Sword Art Online, but far worse since SCP goes infinite subfictional layers.

99% of the verse is less fundamental than an ant in the James Bond movie.

Bump.

What a Nerd!

Tsk tsk tsk tsk. Silly guy, I saw you said my thread was for retards right before you edited it out.